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Author Topic: brandon and once a runner  (Read 5508 times)
Matthieu O’Halloran - "M@"
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« Reply #30 on: July 21, 2011, 06:34:01 PM »

Hey Marco, well since you fit in the group of big guys who struggle on the run.
It definetly limits how much *risks* you can take in run training/racing.
But with proper approach, im convinced you can get the best out of yourself.

Im gonna go a on a ramble here.
To keep the theme of this thread going  Grin
But will come back to you at the end.



Okay, before and after I went to Kenya.
I had heard many difference stories about the Kenyan run regime.
How they did very slow long runs and very fast long runs.

But once I got there.
It wasn't one or the other, well only occasionaly.

If I had only one word to describe their overall training.
Would be *PROGRESSIVE*

And it only makes sense when these guys are running 250+ km a week.
Starting slow would allow them to loosen up from previous heavy training sessions.
Also allow to slowly loosen any minor injuries that they might have.
And more importantly, training a greater range of running speed.

In mainstream running/triathlon now a days.
You hear all these expressions, like aerobic threshold, race pace, zone 1-2-3-4-5, ect.
Which helps to nail down what your working on that day.
But in revenge, it can cause athletes to over reach or simply overthink their session.

Especially armed with heart rate monitors and garmins and power meters.
It helps them to get into their *mode* much faster.

The Kenyans would instead *ease* into most of their sessions.
Track/hill reps/long runs/ect.

Because if they would have a go at it from the start.
Then they might not be able to get in as much volume.
Or simple feel off from the start due to accumulated fatigue.
Where that can play a nasty game with an athletes head.

So a typical 30km long run.
They would run the first bit in lets say 6 min km's.
Then at the bottom of a hill, then would kick it down to 5 min km's.
Until they get to a particular dirt road, where they kick it down to 4 min km's.
Now that their past half way, they pass a big tree thats there since Kip Keino's era.
They kick it down to 3min km's.
Until they pass that elementry school that many of them went to.
Where they kick it down to 2:45 km's and maintain that or speed up.
Until they reach that little eatery that serve great millet poridge with honey and lemond.
Done, regroup and enjoy the poridge!



Okay, so the numbers I used are well kinda of arbitrary.
But just to get the point accross that they will run bellow/at/above their race pace.
And they not bothered by exact distances, but by land marks.
Since very often, the particular circut they run, as been pounded for generations of runners.

Today, their goal is to run those loops faster and faster.

So Marco, if you slow down at the end of your long runs.
Chances are your starting to fast in the first half.

Once I was shouted at during a long progressive run by an unknown Kenyan as I was getting dropped.
"MIZUNGU, dont not teach the body to slow down, only to acclerate"

This progressive approach, historicaly doesn't suite a fast marathon off a 180k.
Because the top IM athletes seem to run better by starting fast.
To nail their rythym when they feeling good, well relatively...

But that doesn't mean that doing progressive training doesn't have its place in triathlon.
Because speeding up at the end of a run session will teach your body to run through pain and strain.
Which is a crutial part of good finish on the run.

So try it out on your next long run, and let us all know.
Start out slower than normal, build into your race pace.
And then kick it above at the end.

Im convinced, you will walk away from that run, a bit stronger.
Than a blow up run.
More importantly, your brain will have had a solid effort as well.
Especially in the departement of patience and content of a good long run.

Because at the end of the day.
Weather your tired from 250+ km week of running.
Or a heavy block or swim/bike/run.
Or a long day at the office.

Starting your run session a bit slower, or even a swim/bike/run that is.
And then building into it, and then going above at the end.
Will be more beneficial than blowing up or cutting your session short.
Because your could not it the numbers.......................................
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Scott DeFillipis - "Scott D"
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« Reply #31 on: July 21, 2011, 06:53:42 PM »

Great post Matty!!  Cool
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Matthieu O’Halloran - "M@"
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« Reply #32 on: July 21, 2011, 07:29:53 PM »

Hey Scotty thanx.
Good blog, I can relate, just on a lesser squale  Wink
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marco.polo
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« Reply #33 on: July 22, 2011, 06:11:16 PM »

wow matt thanks so much...going to try out that progressive run training this sunday...you have any tips for swimming nonstop for long distances...
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Matthieu O’Halloran - "M@"
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« Reply #34 on: July 22, 2011, 10:26:38 PM »

Hey Marco no problem.
Its always a bit difficult to give swim cyber swim advice.
Because I will assume you are late starter for swimming.
From experience, teaching late starters is very often a matter of working with what you got.
Versus trying to fit you into the classic swimming mold.
Thats best for younger and flexible kids with short arms so they learn hand/eye coordination pheasibly.

Best be to work on your engine (heart/lungs)
And the surest way is to do some solid short rest swim sets that are long enuff.
That way, you get descent volume and descent intensity at the same time.
Versus doing the short/fast or long/slow one at a time of which is very common.
Those session all have their place, just prioritize the first point!

Think of swimming as a motion.
And not as a stroke.
Many overthink/analyse the bits and pieces of there stroke.
Versus focusing on the bigger picture.

Many of the best open water swimmers I have trained with.
All seem to compromise pretty much every aspect of their swimming style.
Compromise their glide/catch/finish/bent elbow/kick/hip rotation/finish/ect.

Yes this seems counter intuitive.
But once you put these athletes in a swim start with 100's or even 1000's of swimmers.
Their regular swim style is compromised very little and break down very little versus the good technician.
When they get hit or swim in waves or go around bouys.

One thing that you should never compromise if your turn over.
The fitter and stronger your trainyour engine.
The higher turn over/cadence/rythym you will be able to maintain.
Of which is crutial for navigating in the unpredictable group swim scenario...

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Beck
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« Reply #35 on: July 22, 2011, 11:12:18 PM »

Great post Matt- I really enjoy reading about your Kenyan run stories.
Recently I've been running with a lady once/twice a week.  She is new to running and really wants to build up her mileage.
Our runs are very slow- but instead of going ahead of her and running off on her, I'm content to run alongside her and chat, while focussing on maintaining my quick cadence and form.  I've found by the end of the run, I feel unreal, having eased into.  I've also found that my other run sessions (800's, builds etc) have all improved. 
So who knows?  Maybe these Kenyans are onto something? LOL  Tongue

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Matthieu O’Halloran - "M@"
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« Reply #36 on: July 23, 2011, 12:37:45 PM »

Hey Beck thanx and good to hear!

Running is such a primal activity.
That we been been doing since day one!
And often, technologie can swerve off the point...

I could best describe overall/general life in Kenya as *retro*
What I would imagine modern society years and years ago, appart from a few exeptions of course!

That definetly shows in their running success.

The majority of all sucessfull western coaches in Kenya.
Are the ones that spend the most time there, immersing themself in the local culture.
In a way to better understand what/who they have to work with.
And then go from there on!

Whereas forcing the Kenyans to use modern trainings/foods/tools.
Because they can pretty fragile people with certain things.
Like their diet, sleep and how much running on an asphalt road they do.

Mainly because, they can be affraid of what they dont understand.
And very assertive in things that they do understand!
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pb
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« Reply #37 on: July 25, 2011, 06:28:30 AM »

matty  fab  posts  about  the  kenyans and  swimming !!!!!!!!!!!!
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Matthieu O’Halloran - "M@"
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« Reply #38 on: July 25, 2011, 08:08:49 AM »

Hey pb thank you, I been very lucky to learn from many of the very best  Smiley
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